[Sophie]

CoolAsIceCream, on 23 February 2012 - 04:32 AM, said:

if you've got any other release-related questions, don't hesitate to ask them. my head is almost exploding because it's so full of useless little factoids about smashing pumpkins releases. it would be nice if i could let some more out.

I really appreciate this.
A flower for you: :flowers:/>

I've created a special thread to keep you, the others and myself entertained.
Miscellaneous questions are welcome.

[Sophie]

It concerns the 7" releases of Tristessa.
I've read in that illustrated book …
http://991.com/newGallery/Smashing-Pumpkins-Interview-Disc-An-70537.jpg
… that 2,500 copies of this release comes in pink wax (so says SPfreaks), but hat only 2,000 copies were pressed on a black matrix.
On SPfreaks it is also said that only 200 copies of the grey wax exist which I guess is true, but that roughly 4,500 copies were pressed on a black matrix as 7,500 copies of Sub Pop singles were usually released.

Do you by any chance have any information concerning the real amount of singles pressed on black wax (because of course I own a black version of this vinyl)?
I realize that my question is perhaps not the most relevant one and that person no one actually knows but this is what I had in mind right now.

http://i39.tinypic.com/98eg0p.jpg

[CoolAsIceCream]

the official story is that there are 7500 copies, and 2500 of those were pressed on pink vinyl. the rest on black vinyl.
this isn't correct. the official numbers from sub pop are often wrong.
it is assumed that there are about 4500 pink copies and about 3000 on black vinyl.

you also often read that the grey copies were a "mistake", because the plates weren't cleaned between the black and the pink pressing. this isn't correct either. if that were the case, we'd see a lot more in-between colours, and there would also be less grey copies.

this website is specialised in sub pop singles, and they explain it better than i can: http://www.pettedisc...subpop/sp90.asp

here's a release that does have a proper "mistake" pressing, with more in-between colours: http://www.pettedisc...subpop/sp72.asp (notice that there are no proper grey copies, like we have with the tristessa 7".)

[CoolAsIceCream]

the thing with those pressing quantities is that nobody knows for sure what the exact numbers are. there's a statement from sub pop about the amount of pink vinyl copies, but that's it. and not everyone believes even that number to be correct, so there you go.
if you believe what sub pop says, then there are 2500 pink copies. if you combine that with the fact that there are 7500 copies in total (i'm not even sure if that was ever confirmed), then there must be about 5000 copies on black vinyl. but the black vinyl appears to be harder to find than the pink one, so people conclude that there must be more pink copies than black ones. is that a correct conclusion? i don't know. i agree, but maybe i'm wrong too.

anyway, cool thread. thanks for making it.
where's the next question? anyone? let's not make this thread "teagarden 2".

[Sophie]

Well my guess is that if the pink ones are easier to find it is maybe because people are more in demand of those than of the black ones and perhaps not because there are more copies of them.
People prefer having vinyls pressed on colored wax because it is more decorative. (I won't blame them as I have a rainbow made of Siamese Dream records in my flat ;)/>).
The consequence is that the pink vinyls sale well and people who actually possess them tend to make a lovely fee out of them. Fair enough.
Moreover as those records are not that numerous, there is still a bunch of buyers for them so the average price never decreases and it's a good deal for sellers.
But just like you I may be totally wrong !

I fully agree on the fact that grey vinyls are not "mistakes" because they are far too homogeneous to be a mix of pink and black.

I have plenty of other questions for you don't worry, but I'll post my daily question later on because right now I have to go back to work...
And no need to mention that I am not the only one allowed to post in here! If someone else has a question, please proceed.

[Sophie]

Ok, today I have a question concerning Machina lithographs.

First of all, how many lithograph do exist in the end? I ask this silly question because I often hear there 4 of them but it seems that extra kinds of those exist and maybe more. So does boot-lithographs exist?
http://991.com/NewGallery/Smashing-Pumpkins-MachinaThe-Machin-258026.jpg

Apparently not all of them were dispatched in every country, can you tell me a little bit more about that? Were some of the lithographs dedicated to one specific area?

It also seems that the green lion is quite easy to find. What about the others? Were they printed in the same quantity, etc.

[Sophie]

Sophie, on 24 February 2012 - 07:15 AM, said:

First of all, how many lithograph do exist in the end? I ask this silly question because I often hear there 4 of them but it seems that extra kinds of those exist and maybe more. So does boot-lithographs exist?

Sorry for the huge amount of mistakes. I should read carefully my texts before posting...

[CoolAsIceCream]

i don't know anything more about those lithographs.
i believe there are indeed 4 different lithographs, and the lion one is indeed the easiest to find.
i've always thought there were only given away in the US, in certain stores, to people who bought machina. maybe it was in other countries too. no idea.

in belgium, we got a smashing pumpkins patch/badge with our copie of machina.

http://www.spfreaks.com/data/images%5CCD%27s%20(Official)%5CNL%5CCD%20NL%20Machina%20(with%20promo%20badge)a.jpg
http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=187

[Sophie]

I think that if the lion is easier to find it is because I've read (only God remembers where) that the lion lithograph was also distributed in Australia. Can anyone from this board confirm this info?
I was curious about the lithographs because the first three on the picture I've posted are always the same, whereas you can sometimes see a different picture for the last one.

http://i41.tinypic.com/21bod1k.jpg

A "textiel badge" with Machina, how odd?? It looks like a gift from... OK I don't want to troll here.;)/>
Behind the link you posted towards SPfreaks it is said that the CD was sold with this extra gift in "The Netherlands (because of the Dutch matrixcode), [but..] also released in Belgium, and maybe in France too."
I can only tell you one thing, my copy bought in France was sadly not sold with this extra thing but I may have been scammed, who knows.

************************

Now let's go back to Mellon Collie Singles.
I've noticed that TAFH singles have diffrent "covers" than the original singles. The covers in the box set are usually only one page (printed back and front), whereas the original single has a folded card inside. See for instance my copies of 1979 (original 4-tracks single on top with a folded page where the lyrics are printed, and TAFH copy on the bottom).

http://i41.tinypic.com/11he841.jpg

As far as original singles are concerned I often only have the UK releases, ie. the ones in slimline jewel cases and I wonder if the US releases (or more generally copies with a regular jewel case) also have a different "booklet" ie a folded card instead of a single page like in TAFH.

I'm not sure that I'm making myself clear here... :scatch:/>

[CoolAsIceCream]

i've never seen that second litograph.

i personally think that badge only came with (some) copies in belgium, because the sticker has dutch and french. they would never attach a sticker with dutch and french for a release in france or the netherlands. it doesn't make sense. the fact that the cd has a dutch matrix code only means it was pressed in the netherlands, not that it was released there.
but who knows? maybe someone did in fact buy a copy of that release in the netherlands, and that's why they added the netherlands to that list?

i believe i understand what you're asking about the single page inserts. i'll address this later.

[CoolAsIceCream]

i know basically nothing about posters. so i'm sorry i can't really add much.

i've had a look on www.spfreaks.com and found an entry for the australian lion litho. so i guess that explanation is correct. (all i know from searching ebay, is that you always see that lion one, and never any of the other lithos. i didn't notice that the sellers were australian.)
that extra "litho" you posted, i've never seen as a litho. i've seen it on other machina artwork though. check these out, for example: http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=621 http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=633
when you say you sometimes see that as the 4th one, does it look like the other lithos (artwork in upper half, "the smashing pumpkins" + logo in the lower half)? or where or how did you see this other one?

about the single page inserts for the tafh box, i can tell you that the only reason they did that is because all the information that is on the separate singles (lyrics, author, copyright, etc.) didn't need to be repeated on the tafh disc inserts. all this info is already in the tafh booklet. this is why they went for single page inserts. it looks very similar to the proper singles, but they didn't need to make exact reproductions. related: the tafh discs don't have barcodes on the back. once again, there was no need for this.
so this isn't a typical US thing here, or something typical for regular jewel cases. it's just because these discs were in the set.
normally the singles with regular jewel cases also have a folded front insert, with information on the inside. i think the only other cases where there are only single page inserts (or no front insert) is with promotional releases.
also, when a single comes in a slim case, the insert is always double, but most of the time, there is no info on the inside. the inside is just white.
i'll check my collection later though. maybe i can add some more info.

[Mayfair]

shit bram was just waiting for someone to make this thread lol

[CoolAsIceCream]

not just waiting. i basically asked for one. well, the thread wasn't my idea, but i was asking for something.

[Sophie]

Ok so first an answer to the lithograph question (and then my daily question ;)/>).
I once saw for sale (on Priceminister if I remember well) what I considered to be a "fake" Machina lithograph made with the second picture I posted. I'm pretty sure it was fake because you could see that the paper was low quality, i.e. not like this :

http://i39.tinypic.com/15xodwy.jpg

I think a series of fake and low quality lithos were made based on what is reported on this website which is the first link that appears when you google "machina lithographs" and which hasn't been updated for ages as far as SP are concerned...

Anyway I just wanted to be sure that there was no genuine litho with the picture of the "alchemical sisters" available.

[Sophie]

Today's question is related to my personal experience.

I have (eventually !!) registered on SPfreaks today. Tadam !

So tonight, tonight I thought that I could start listing my collection and I said to myself: "OK nice and easy, let's start with Gish first releases on CD."
Surprisingly enough I could not determine exactly which copy was this one. :blink:/> Could you help me on this point? Here are pics of my CD:

http://i42.tinypic.com/1zlyzhz.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/2j2urz7.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2vbr3g1.jpg

It is said to be made in Holland so I checked at the dutch release and the picture on the CD is obviously different. Look here

Mine looks like the german release but the latter is said to be manufactured in Germany whereas mine is said to be printed in Holland. Look here

So which one is mine? An alternate one? :scatch:/>

[CoolAsIceCream]

i think this is indeed a different release, not yet present on spfreaks.com.
highly interesting.
can you see any ifpi codes in the matrix code? (two different ones?)
do you remember when you bought this, approximately? and where? did you buy it in a big/small record shop? was it new? was it second hand?

this looks like it's a dutch pressing, but pressed before the 1994 remaster. (one could conclude it dates from 1991, when gish was originally released, but i personally don't think that's the case here.)

[Sophie]

CoolAsIceCream, on 29 February 2012 - 12:54 AM, said:

i think this is indeed a different release, not yet present on spfreaks.com.
highly interesting.
can you see any ifpi codes in the matrix code? (two different ones?)
do you remember when you bought this, approximately? and where? did you buy it in a big/small record shop? was it new? was it second hand?

this looks like it's a dutch pressing, but pressed before the 1994 remaster. (one could conclude it dates from 1991, when gish was originally released, but i personally don't think that's the case here.)

I'll tell you about the ifpi codes tonight when I come back from work.
The only thing I can tell you right know is that I bought this CD second hand from some french guy who was selling his collection of CDs from the 90s long after Gish was released, so sadly I have no information concerning its first appearance on the music market :(/>

[CoolAsIceCream]

also, do you have a scanner? can you makes scans like this? http://www.spfreaks....TAILS&item=3596
then we can add it to the spfreaks.com collection, and then you'll be able to add your cd to your personal spfreaks.com collection.

[Sophie]

Actually I intended to do so.

I should be able to get high quality scans of my CD.
I'll check what I can do with the scanner tonight as well and will keep you in touch.

[Sophie]

Ok so first of all, there is not other code on the CD than the ones you can on the first picture of my former post. Not even a hidden one in the translucent part of the matrix.
The only codes are therefore the following:

• 1-1-1-NL
  
• 786754 2 @ 2

Second of all I've performed high quality scans of the disc and the inserts (much more larger than what you can see below), but I'll send them to SPfreaks tomorrow because it is almost 2AM around here and even though I suffer from insomnia I have to go to work early tomorrow... :sleeping:/>

http://i40.tinypic.com/x3iiqb.jpg http://i43.tinypic.com/156suwh.jpg http://i41.tinypic.com/8vxerp.jpg

[CoolAsIceCream]

ok, thanks!

[Sophie]

I've just sent my pics to SPfreaks.
Now I'm going back to work after lunch break.
See you later for my daily question.

PS: Dear God you could tell it was late when I posted the pics yesterday, my english was awful (who just said "as usual"? :angry:/> )

[Sophie]

FAIL !

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients failed.

spf-contact@spfreaks.com

So my question today might be: how do I send pics to SPfreaks?

[CoolAsIceCream]

ah yeah, the mail server on spfreaks.com doesn't work right now. they're working on a new version of the site, and this is one of the things they're planning to fix at the same time.
you can reach them at: spfreaks at? gmail (something - you can guess it) com

can you send them to me too? (my username on here) at! gmail (same thing as above) com
thx.

[Sophie]

Your wish is my command.

Done!

[Sophie]

I found something weird tonight about this copy of Siamese Dream.
On the back cover, the french distribution code is F:PM 527 whereas on the CD it is printed PM 520.
Question 1: is it possible?

http://i40.tinypic.com/o9n038.jpg http://i42.tinypic.com/9kxbtf.jpg

There are lots of scratches on the jewel case but I kept it because first it is probably the original one as it looks rather old (another CD that I bought second hand so I can't be 100% sure) and second of all it is surprisingly...light grey as you can see on the CD pic!

Question 2: Is this copy the same as this release (here) of the album?
Note that in addition to the ditribution code, one of the matrix codes also differs by 2 digits (1-5-9-NL instead of 1-2-3-NL). Other matrix codes are the same though (and ifpi code is 1511).
http://i40.tinypic.com/73lysn.jpg http://i42.tinypic.com/35i7qrc.jpg

I think it could also be this one (here) but honestly I can't be positive about anything...

[CoolAsIceCream]

i'm not really sure what that "PM" code means. i've never looked at it as a proper release code. (with only three digits, there could only be 1000 unique release codes. which isn't very interesting.)

about the 1-5-9-NL: you shouldn't worry. these engraved codes do change. it's still the same release.
i might be wrong, but i believe these numbers are used at the pressing plant to identify the master/father/mother/sons (not sure which ones exactly) this particular cd was made with. when they're pressing a lot of cds, they often have to change the mould, resulting in a lot of changes in the last number, and a couple of changes in the second number. the first number will rarely change, but it can happen.
http://en.wikipedia....#Electroforming
now i haven't looked this up. so maybe i'm way off here.
but yeah, at spfreaks, we simply write down the code that is on the disc that's being added. but copies of the same release can exist - and normally always do - where that bit of code doesn't match.

[EDIT]
i found something about these PM codes: http://wiki.discogs....tribution_Codes

and related, about the LC code: http://wiki.discogs....php/Label_Codes

This post has been edited by CoolAsIceCream: 02 March 2012 - 03:32 AM

[Sophie]

Sorry, I've been off for the week end.
Thank you again for your detailed answer concerning release codes, this should calm down the OCD of my academic brain for a while ;)/>.
Moreover it answers a bunch of absolutely boring questions that I had concerning release numbers...

Today's question is going to be about the Siamese dream singles vinyl box set.
I've always thought that the singles in the box set were pressed on a black matrix, but I've seen from time to time box sets sold with coloured vinyls inside.
Question is: Was there a proper release of this item or did the collector selling the item replaced the black records by coloured ones?
http://991.com/newGallery/Smashing-Pumpkins-Siamese-Singles--291375.jpg

In the meantime: why is the peach Rocket single always so expensive? I'm still missing this item... :(/>

[CoolAsIceCream]

ok, let's get this started again.
i wasn't feeling very well last week, so i haven't put much energy into this thread. je suis désolé.

we've got some unfinished business here:
- the question about cd single inserts, being double or single, and sometimes white too. i will check some singles and see if there's anything meaningful that can be said about it. probably not. but i'll see. is there anything specific you want answered?
- and then we have those different distribution codes on that siamese dream cd. after a very quick glance at spfreaks.com, it looks like all cds say PM 520, whereas the inserts have different numbers (see also the second siamese dream cd you linked to). this is, unfortunately, again something i don't know off the top of my head. but i will look into this.

Sophie, on 05 March 2012 - 01:10 AM, said:

Sorry, I've been off for the week end.
Thank you again for your detailed answer concerning release codes, this should calm down the OCD of my academic brain for a while ;)/>.
Moreover it answers a bunch of absolutely boring questions that I had concerning release numbers...

Today's question is going to be about the Siamese dream singles vinyl box set.
I've always thought that the singles in the box set were pressed on a black matrix, but I've seen from time to time box sets sold with coloured vinyls inside.
Question is: Was there a proper release of this item or did the collector selling the item replaced the black records by coloured ones?
http://991.com/newGallery/Smashing-Pumpkins-Siamese-Singles--291375.jpg

In the meantime: why is the peach Rocket single always so expensive? I'm still missing this item... :(/>

there were 5 releases:
- cherub rock 7" on clear vinyl (numbered)
- today 7" on red vinyl
- disarm 7" on purple vinyl
- rocket 7" on peach vinyl + box to collect the other singles in
- siamese singles box, containing the four singles on black vinyl (the cherub rock single isn't numbered. the number box on the front is blacked out.)

so if you find a siamese singles box that has all the coloured singles, someone simply collected all four singles and put them together in the rocket box.

if you find a box with coloured and black vinyl, someone has been mixing up releases. these mixed up box sets are basically worthless. the coloured singles still have some value of their own, but the black singles are now an incomplete release.

the rocket 7" + box is rarer than the other singles, and also rarer than the siamese singles box set release. so it makes sense that it's more expensive.
spfc.org estimates the amount of copies as follows:
cherub rock: 5000
today: 5000
disarm: 7000
rocket: 1500
siamese singles: 6000
if you think about it, a box with four coloured singles is worth more than one with black vinyl. ok, it's not a proper release, it's the combination of four releases, but if you add the value of the four releases, it's worth more than the box set release with the black vinyl. i'd even estimate the peach rocket 7" + box higher than the siamese singles release.

i hope this answers your question. :)/>

ps: the box that comes with the rocket 7" is slightly different to the one that comes with the 4 black singles. there's that sticker, and i believe the release code isn't the same either.
see spfreaks.com. the internet is being very slow right now, so i can't really look it up myself at the moment.

[CoolAsIceCream]

pps: i made it. check it out for yourself!
http://www.spfreaks....TAILS&item=1116
http://www.spfreaks....TAILS&item=1117

[.absof.]

Cool. Didn't know about the coloured vinyls being chucked in with other ones.

Checked mine. All black. :happy:/>

[Sophie]

I was looking for the Rocket peach vinyl and now I freakingly NEED this thing WITH the box set to store the other records.
Damn it, ignorance is bliss ! :banghead:/>

Concerning the single inserts now:

I have plenty of them in slimline jewel cases (EU releases most of the time) but very few in regular jewel cases (US releases most of the time), and I just wondered if it was worthy to collect the latter i.e. if the inserts were generally different, more complete and nicer, with the lyrics printed on them, etc. Inserts in slimline jewel case are always a folded cardboard with a completely white side inside so nothing really exiting...

Of course as I already own those singles + TAFH box set+...+... there's absolutely no emergency here and I have other items in mind to enrich my collection with prior to those, but I asked the question in case I would have an interesting opportunity to buy one, because.. well..you never know and I'm weak as far as SP releases are concerned...:blush:/>

[CoolAsIceCream]

you shouldn't buy the rocket 7" without the box. it was never released without a box. be glad that you know this now. otherwise it'd have been wasted money. and who knows how much you would have paid for that.

few smashing pumpkins singles come in regular cases, actually. even if they're american. american promo releases often come in regular cases. the european counterparts of these promo cds will often come in cardboard sleeves.

i can't think of any foreign release that comes with more artwork/notes than its european counterpart, but i'll have a look. japanese albums will come with an extra booklet, full of japanese stuff, as well as an interpretation of the lyrics. quite funny, but there's no extra artwork here.
of course there are always things that got an american release, but no european one (drown, muzzle, crestfallen, to sheila). they have artwork you won't find anywhere else.

when i started looking into this last week, i also found a european single (tarantula) in a slim case, that didn't have a folded insert (with white on the inside), but instead had a single insert, printed on both sides. aha! not really that interesting, but it shows that everything exists.
i also had this thing in the back of my mind that a folded slimcase insert existed that did have stuff on the inside. however, i can't find any, so i think i imagined that one.

[CoolAsIceCream]

another european tarantula single looked almost identical, but did have the double slim case insert, with white on the inside.
i believe one single had two tracks, the other one had three. i can't remember which one was which.

[CoolAsIceCream]

i've checked the american singles, and i've come to the conclusion that there simply aren't that many US cd singles. most of them come in a regular jewel case. so i was wrong about that.

this is what i've found:
lull (more EP than single, but hey)
US reissues for all(?) pre-MCIS singles (peel sessions, i am one, cherub rock, ...)
the mcis singles (all 4 tracks, except bullet: 2 tracks, and the zero EP: 7 tracks)
ava adore (3 tracks)
perfect (3 tracks)
that's the way (2 tracks)

the only ones that come in slim cases are the american reissues of those pre-MCIS UK singles. they look very much like UK singles. they even say "Made in England", even when that's not the case. very hard to see the difference, and also hard to find, i find. i only have two of these.

the mcis singles all come with a folded front insert, with lyrics on the inside.
the bullet and 1979 single have the lyrics for the main track, the other singles have the lyrics for all songs.
the bullet single has the recording info etc. on the back of the front insert, not on the inside. it does have the sp heart on one page of the inside. all the other singles have the extra info on the inside.

now this is where it gets interesting: the last three singles all have a single page front insert.
the back of the adore single inserts have "extra artwork", but it's just vague black pictures. i'll post a picture soon.
the back of the that's the way single insert is just plain white. (haha! on a commercial single. so poor they couldn't afford any artwork for the back of the front insert.)

i guess i could now go and check all promos, but that would take me too far.

one thing i can now think of is the i of the mourning promo. this american jewel case promo has definitely more artwork that it's european cardsleeve counterpart. the front is the same, but the inside and back are extra.
http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=195
http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=350

and then you also have the spanish promo for try, try, try, for example. this one has unique artwork. but that doesn't really count, i guess.
http://www.spfreaks....ETAILS&item=227

here's that picture of the back of the front inserts of the two US adore era cd singles:
http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s404/absolutelygroundbreaking/inserts/adore_us_singles.jpg

here's a picture of the back of the front insert (single page) of the i of the mourning US promo:
http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s404/absolutelygroundbreaking/inserts/iotm_us_promo.jpg

i guess the perfect cd single picture is just a picture of some ivy growing on a brick wall. i believe the ava adore cd single uses a close-up from that same picture.

[snail33]

so let me see if i'm getting this right on the siamese boxes, because i had always thought i had it together...

there are 2 instances in which a purple "siamese singles" box was sold as an official release, one that contained all 4 singles on black vinyl (including rocket? i have never heard of nor seen a black rocket), and the other a slightly differently-labeled box with just the PEACH rocket in, which was intended to then ideally house the other 3 coloured vinyls if and when you could find them, but which would never constitute an official release per se?

this would mean that in my case, wherein i have the box that comes with the 3 black vinyls, AND i have the first 3 singles on clear/red/purple as well, AND i have (just bought recently on ebay for like $60) the peach rocket, but it was sold by itself with no box...that i STILL don't have any (or "either", as it were) of the actual, official s.s. boxsets, neither the 4-black or the 4-coloured-but-in-the-right-box versions? i would still have to either track down (and shell out for) either the box sold with the peach rocket or a box with 4 black 45's? because that would suck.

and what i don't get is this: if these versions described above are the official and/or organically collected versions, why do all these people selling never sell them that way? wouldn't they stand to make as much if not MORE money by selling to crazy-ass collectorfans like us the REAL shit we want and not some oddly divided pieces which aren't really worth more? i could see maybe the odd collector here or there who somehow lost track of part of a complete set or who only came across part of one, and wanted to make a quick buck... but as i said, i have been casting about on ebay and the like for some years now in search of the box, and have never seen a picture of a black rocket vinyl and RARELY seen a peach rocket and box ALONE, which i guess is part of where my confusion came from.

[CoolAsIceCream]

yes, the siamese singles box comes with all four singles on black vinyl.

it's really simple. it's like i said above. there are five releases: the four singles, released separately, on coloured vinyl; the rocket one coming with a box. and then the siamese singles box set as one release, containing all four singles, including rocket, on black vinyl.

i see siamese singles on ebay often. and i've seen it go for peanuts (£30).

i don't think i've seen more than one or two sets that were mixed up. but i also wonder where they come from. obviously someone has messed up a perfectly nice and complete set somewhere in the past, and then who knows what happened afterwards?

regarding your situation: indeed, except for the three coloured singles, all the rest you own is incomplete. i'm sorry.

http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s404/absolutelygroundbreaking/siamese%20singles/sticker.jpg
here's a picture of the sticker on the rocket box. it explains what it's all about.

here's the proof that the rocket single on black vinyl does exist:
http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s404/absolutelygroundbreaking/siamese%20singles/black_rocket.jpg

and here's an illustration of the blacked out number box on that siamese singles cherub rock 7" on black vinyl.
the sleeve on the left is from siamese singles. on the right you can see the clear vinyl and its numbered sleeve.
http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s404/absolutelygroundbreaking/siamese%20singles/cherubs.jpg

[CoolAsIceCream]

another clue that the rocket 7" was never sold separately is that the sleeve doesn't carry a barcode. the barcode is on the box.
(another explanation could be that it was released as a promo, but this isn't the case here.)

here's a siamese singles on ebay that isn't too expensive (yet): www.ebay.co.uk/itm/290677920589
it looks like it's the proper, all black vinyl version, but if it isn't mentioned (i don't see it mentioned) and you're not sure, you should always ask. because you know you don't want to buy it if it's mixed up. (unless, for some reason, you don't mind. then go ahead, obviously.) if they don't answer, don't bid.

This post has been edited by CoolAsIceCream: 05 March 2012 - 12:50 PM

[Sophie]

CoolAsIceCream, on 05 March 2012 - 01:24 AM, said:

i wasn't feeling very well last week, so i haven't put much energy into this thread. je suis désolé.

Ik hoop dat u zich beter!
OK I can't speak any dutch but I thought you should be rewarded for your detailed answers and for having apologized in french. Very sweet from you. Especially since I don't think you owed me any appology...

CoolAsIceCream, on 05 March 2012 - 04:21 AM, said:

you shouldn't buy the rocket 7" without the box. it was never released without a box. be glad that you know this now. otherwise it'd have been wasted money. and who knows how much you would have paid for that.

Absolutely true! This is the reason why I created that thread and I found that piece of information higly interesting!

Thank you so much for the details concerning all the singles. Actually it makes the singles hunting far more interesting. I don't know what else to say except taht I'll keep track of everything you said for further research.
And it is funny indeed to see that some cds were sold without any artwork on the back cover (wtf???).

CoolAsIceCream, on 05 March 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

just a picture of some ivy growing on a brick wall. i believe the ava adore cd single uses a close-up from that same picture.

It could totally be something like that. I've noticed for instance that the standard release of Perfect has a back cover which is a close-up of the back cover of the one-track promo CD (see the picture below). Actually I think that the back cover of both singles you posted before could even be close-ups of the close up! ;)/>
Anyway it is always the same dawn brick wall!

http://i41.tinypic.com/2a5nrr4.jpg

snail33, on 05 March 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:

...AND i have (just bought recently on ebay for like $60) the peach rocket, but it was sold by itself with no box...

So that was you who bought that "australian" vinyl I had my beady eye on... ;)/>

[snail33]

CoolAsIceCream, on 05 March 2012 - 11:54 AM, said:

yes, the siamese singles box comes with all four singles on black vinyl.

it's really simple. it's like i said above. there are five releases: the four singles, released separately, on coloured vinyl; the rocket one coming with a box. and then the siamese singles box set as one release, containing all four singles, including rocket, on black vinyl.

i see siamese singles on ebay often. and i've seen it go for peanuts (£30).

i don't think i've seen more than one or two sets that were mixed up. but i also wonder where they come from. obviously someone has messed up a perfectly nice and complete set somewhere in the past, and then who knows what happened afterwards?

regarding your situation: indeed, except for the three coloured singles, all the rest you own is incomplete. i'm sorry.

i wasn't doubting you. and i'm sorry it was "really simple" and i bothered you so to answer about it.

[CoolAsIceCream]

Sophie, on 05 March 2012 - 03:01 PM, said:

It could totally be something like that. I've noticed for instance that the standard release of Perfect has a back cover which is a close-up of the back cover of the one-track promo CD (see the picture below). Actually I think that the back cover of both singles you posted before could even be close-ups of the close up! ;)/>
Anyway it is always the same dawn brick wall!

ooh. well spotted.

[CoolAsIceCream]

i guess i could have answered more to the point with "yes, that's correct", instead of repeating everything. that would probably have been better.

and the second part of my post got appended, because i made it too soon after the first post. but it was a separate post.

[wolfgang]

interesting

[CoolAsIceCream]

Sophie, on 05 March 2012 - 03:01 PM, said:

Ik hoop dat u zich beter!

thanks.

you forgot a word though. ik hoop dat u zich beter voelt. ou, avec un peu de "tutoyage", ik hoop dat je je beter voelt.

any more questions?