[KissesandNoise]

I was hesitant because Jimmy was gone. I knew Billy had a penchant for Goth electronica and this might be his chance. Then I listened to it. Coincidentally I was going through a break-up at the time and the album resonated very deeply with me. It is definitely one of the most overlooked masterpieces in modern music. Although it's received good press in the last few years.

I listened to it non-stop for months, then I got the chance to see them on the Adore charity tour in Atlanta. It blew my mind. Billy (along with Kenny Aranoff and 2 more percussionists to fill JC's void) completely rocked. Every bit of synth was reinterpreted with piano and tons of howling guitar. It completely changed the energy of the album. Truly amazing.

[KissesandNoise]

That layered symphonic guitar outro on "For Martha" is sublime. Gives me chills every time.

[adamdanger!]

KissesandNoise, on 16 June 2011 - 10:34 AM, said:

That layered symphonic guitar outro on "For Martha" is sublime. Gives me chills every time.

Thanks. Now that is stuck in my head hardcore. lol

[awsmsc]

All I knew about SP was that I liked the Tonight,Tonight video. So I got SD and Adore in 1998 (I was 12 at the time) and I liked Adore more (I didn't really "get" SD, though now I'd say it's no par with Adore). Adore was my fav album at the time and it's still up there tied with SD and MCIS. I listened to it almost every day for a year.

[Brundisium]

KissesandNoise, on 16 June 2011 - 10:34 AM, said:

That layered symphonic guitar outro on "For Martha" is sublime. Gives me chills every time.

Totally. It's almost too much sometimes. But in a good way.

[dudehitscar]

a couple parts give me chills

1. all you have to do harmonies into the atonal brick wall of noise on Behold

2. Take a day plant some trees may they shade you from me... may your children play beneath(that part)


behold, for martha, and blank page is one of the best 3 song runs ever.

[Matteo]

dudehitscar, on 17 June 2011 - 05:10 PM, said:

a couple parts give me chills

1. all you have to do harmonies into the atonal brick wall of noise on Behold

2. Take a day plant some trees may they shade you from me... may your children play beneath(that part)


behold, for martha, and blank page is one of the best 3 song runs ever.

haha behold gave me chills too but not at that part, it gave me chills where he says "where the willows weep, and the whirl pool sleeps, you'll find me." those might not be the right words though ha.

my first impression of adore was that it was awesome. simple as that. i even like it better than siamese, it actually might be my favorite.

[themadcaplaughs]

My first impression of Adore was...honestly...nothing really. There were a few songs that really spoke to me right off the bat ("Ava Adore," "Pug," and "Annie-Dog") but most of it was really just nothing that really enthused me much. Although I could recognize it was different, I did not see what all the fuss was about in terms of Billy changing things up; I still felt it was instantly recognizable as Smashing Pumpkins. However, like many people have pointed out, this album grows on you.

Quote

a couple parts give me chills

1. all you have to do harmonies into the atonal brick wall of noise on Behold

2. Take a day plant some trees may they shade you from me... may your children play beneath(that part)


behold, for martha, and blank page is one of the best 3 song runs ever.

So many great parts like that on the album... some more I like are...

-The end of "Daphne Descends" (with the processed Billy choir singing "she loves him")
-The "I go bowling" part of "Once Upon a Time"
-James' guitar solo in "Ava Adore"
-All of shame (but particularly the ebow that runs throughout the song)

[Matteo]

themadcaplaughs, on 17 June 2011 - 05:49 PM, said:

-The "I go bowling" part of "Once Upon a Time"

haha do you really think he says "i go bowling"?

it's "i went falling"

[themadcaplaughs]

^^
I know..but that's kind of been a thing around the Internet since the album came out...kind like the "Miller Light" line in "Rocket."

[Matteo]

oh really? sorry didn't know that. haha.

[frosty]

i thought it was horrible & i only liked a few songs. still think some of it is horrible. and, i didn't like the retro vibe in some of the songs. and, i was wanting more rock instead.

[Parksey]

themadcaplaughs, on 17 June 2011 - 05:49 PM, said:

My first impression of Adore was...honestly...nothing really. There were a few songs that really spoke to me right off the bat ("Ava Adore," "Pug," and "Annie-Dog") but most of it was really just nothing that really enthused me much. Although I could recognize it was different, I did not see what all the fuss was about in terms of Billy changing things up; I still felt it was instantly recognizable as Smashing Pumpkins. However, like many people have pointed out, this album grows on you.



So many great parts like that on the album... some more I like are...

-The end of "Daphne Descends" (with the processed Billy choir singing "she loves him")
-The "I go bowling" part of "Once Upon a Time"
-James' guitar solo in "Ava Adore"
-All of shame (but particularly the ebow that runs throughout the song)

You sure Iha played that solo?

[stellar.]

purelunasea80, on 15 June 2011 - 04:53 PM, said:

like someone mentioned above, i feel like mcis prepared us for adore, and not this mook-rock idea that it was some drastic left turn.

No way. Majority of people following the band throughout the early 90's did not expect this drastic change. There were some hints on MCIS, but even songs like Eye and The Begining is the End, still rocked on some level. Way more than anything that would end up on Adore.

I like Adore, but it's hard to get through the whole album in one sitting. I think the live versions of those songs are way more interesting.

[vixnix]

I wanted to like it, and I tried to like it because I was still a diehard fan then. But I didn't like it, it felt to me like the well had run dry.

I kept listening to it though, it was the only album I didn't take as a CD when I went to the states in 99...I had it as a tape and listened to it a lot in my walkman as I travelled about. So I still have good associations with the music, but I don't particularly like the music itself. I think it was the first SP album where you had to trust that Billy was a good songwriter, it wasn't obvious to everyone any more. And I have always had lingering doubts, since adore. That same year my favourite albums, that I loved straight away, were Moon Safari by Air, Back to Back by the Montgomery Brothers, and Is This Desire? by PJ Harvey. I listened to SD way more than Adore, that year. I think it might have been a production issue though. I haven't enjoyed the production on SP albums since MCIS/TAFH.

[Fernando]

By now (and for a long time) Adore is my favorite album.

When you can go over the stereotypical idea that rock is only made from guitars you really enjoy the album.

Adore is more than only music. It's something really really deeper!

[hello_juliana]

Adore saved my life. Adore is more than music to me. It really pains me to read how some people won't ever give adore a chance. But at the same time maybe it makes the album more special.


Really hurt me to see BC say that adore as a mistake when machina came out. Broke my heart.

j'adore adore.

[themadcaplaughs]

Quote

You sure Iha played that solo?

Pretty sure, I can remember Iha mentioning it in an interview...the one where he said "Pug" was originally a blues death march or something to that effect. And, it sounds exactly like Iha's playing style.

[MachinaAdore]

Oh, I hated it at first! I didn't so much think it was depressing as I did dull murky and lifeless. I had to forced myself to listen to it about 7 or times just so it wouldn't be a complete waste of money. And then I started to pay attention to the wistful melodies, and then how poetic the lyrics were. Plus, I was going through a though time at that point, and I started to identify w/ the sense of loss and dread. If you look to the left you'll see it's my favorite SP album now. Nothing even comes close, in my opinion.

[SpangledUser]

at first, i absolutely despised it (Tales Of Dusty And Pistol Pete was an excepcion)
half an year later more or less, i began liking Shame and To Sheila
another half year more (now) i began liking Ava Adore, Pug, Daphne Descends, Crestfallen and For Martha

[SpangledUser]

themadcaplaughs, on 18 June 2011 - 08:54 AM, said:

Pretty sure, I can remember Iha mentioning it in an interview...the one where he said "Pug" was originally a blues death march or something to that effect. And, it sounds exactly like Iha's playing style.

i think they both play the solo

[purelunasea80]

stellar., on 18 June 2011 - 12:08 AM, said:

No way. Majority of people following the band throughout the early 90's did not expect this drastic change. There were some hints on MCIS, but even songs like Eye and The Begining is the End, still rocked on some level. Way more than anything that would end up on Adore.

I like Adore, but it's hard to get through the whole album in one sitting. I think the live versions of those songs are way more interesting.

other songs that could/should have "prepared you for" adore:

1979
tonight, tonight
to forgive
love
cupid de locke
galapagos
in the arms of sleep
thirty-three
stumbleine
beautiful
by starlight
lily
we only come out at night
farewell and goodnight
the last song
set the ray to jerry
cherry
pennies
the bells
the boy
believe
take me down

i would argue every one of these songs is more kindred to adore than they are to siamese dream. mellon collie is a an assortment of all the sounds in billy (and james') heads...the heavy, grungy, sludgy, metally, proggy, etc. along with the dreamy, poppy, dancey, moody. adore did not take me aback one bit when i heard it. something like machina would have surprised me more in 1998.

[purelunasea80]

vixnix, on 18 June 2011 - 06:29 AM, said:

I wanted to like it, and I tried to like it because I was still a diehard fan then. But I didn't like it, it felt to me like the well had run dry.

I kept listening to it though, it was the only album I didn't take as a CD when I went to the states in 99...I had it as a tape and listened to it a lot in my walkman as I travelled about. So I still have good associations with the music, but I don't particularly like the music itself. I think it was the first SP album where you had to trust that Billy was a good songwriter, it wasn't obvious to everyone any more. And I have always had lingering doubts, since adore. That same year my favourite albums, that I loved straight away, were Moon Safari by Air, Back to Back by the Montgomery Brothers, and Is This Desire? by PJ Harvey. I listened to SD way more than Adore, that year. I think it might have been a production issue though. I haven't enjoyed the production on SP albums since MCIS/TAFH.

the brilliance of billy's songwriting wasn't reaffirmed for you by things like ava adore, to sheila, once upon a time, behold, pug?

[purelunasea80]

hello_juliana, on 18 June 2011 - 08:09 AM, said:

Adore saved my life. Adore is more than music to me. It really pains me to read how some people won't ever give adore a chance. But at the same time maybe it makes the album more special.


Really hurt me to see BC say that adore as a mistake when machina came out. Broke my heart.

j'adore adore.

i think he meant that from the standpoint of commercial strategy, not artistic validity.

[purelunasea80]

SpangledUser, on 18 June 2011 - 11:02 AM, said:

at first, i absolutely despised it (Tales Of Dusty And Pistol Pete was an excepcion)
half an year later more or less, i began liking Shame and To Sheila
another half year more (now) i began liking Ava Adore, Pug, Daphne Descends, Crestfallen and For Martha

wow, i think dusty is easily the weakest song on the record and one of the worst they've ever done.

[crepe]

Annie dog is far worst than Dusty.

[soniclovenoize]

My first listens to Adore were long in the making...

I remember hearing "Need" (or "17", if you got really snooty) a few days after he performed it back in 1997 as a .rm and loved it. I did some tape trades to get the show where they performed the full-band versions of "Never Part" and "Need" and they both blew me away... "Never Apart" seemed like classic Pumpkins! Did some more trades for the Bridge School Benefits where they also played "To Shelia" and "Nightmare" and both amazed me, especially "Nightmare". Early 1998, I did a trade with Andrew Pakula for the Viper Room shows (man, it might have been mp3-sourced!) and got to hear those ten songs, and my favorite was then "Tear" (but rhymes with beer, of course!).

Then I was so excited later that spring to finally hear the studio version of "Never apart"--which was actually called "Ava Adore"? What does that even mean? And I heard it, expecting the live versions they had done before, and I did not like it. After about 10 listens, I "got it" and thought "OK, I can dig this direction. It's like TEITBITE, but even more out there..."

Finally, the day Adore was released was the same day of the dress rehearsal for my high school reunion, so we needn't stay the whole day. My friend and I left at noon, went straight to the CD store and bought Adore... Had a listen on my parents' surround sound system and full blast, and I was borderline "wtf" and borderline floored... I think I was prepared by Ava Adore I think for the electronic influence (because I was never a big electronic fan), but I could always look past that and recognize the songwriting, some of Corgan's best at that point in time. I pretty much loved the whole album I think, even though I was VERY disappointed "Need"/"17"--which we now know as "Blissed and Gone"--was absent, and the album's concluding tease didn't help me much. Maybe a b-side some day? ;)/>

This post has been edited by soniclovenoize: 18 June 2011 - 06:12 PM

[Fernando]

crepe, on 18 June 2011 - 05:02 PM, said:

Annie dog is far worst than Dusty.

Annie-Dog is the only song tthat I can't listen to too much out of the record. But, it reealy makes sense on the album (My Mistake would be better tho)

[vixnix]

purelunasea80, on 18 June 2011 - 04:33 PM, said:

the brilliance of billy's songwriting wasn't reaffirmed for you by things like ava adore, to sheila, once upon a time, behold, pug?

Of those songs the only one I liked was To Sheila. And even then it felt like a lean offering. Everybody hates Annie Dog but it was the only one I ever played to anyone and it's still my favorite off the album. I did think the others were interesting but I didn't like them enough to really want to listen to them. A lot of the production I found to be kinda off putting. A lot of layers put in by someone who didn't know what they were doung when they put each piece in it's place. I think if they'd had a better producer I probably would have liked a lot of those songs. I probably liked Annie Dog and to Sheila because they were stripped down. If the whole album had that minimalist feel I might have really loved it. Or if it had all the bells and whistles but had been better arranged like SD and MCIS I would have probably enjoyed it, too.

[stellar.]

purelunasea80, on 18 June 2011 - 04:31 PM, said:

other songs that could/should have "prepared you for" adore:

1979
tonight, tonight
to forgive
love
cupid de locke
galapagos
in the arms of sleep
thirty-three
stumbleine
beautiful
by starlight
lily
we only come out at night
farewell and goodnight
the last song
set the ray to jerry
cherry
pennies
the bells
the boy
believe
take me down

i would argue every one of these songs is more kindred to adore than they are to siamese dream. mellon collie is a an assortment of all the sounds in billy (and james') heads...the heavy, grungy, sludgy, metally, proggy, etc. along with the dreamy, poppy, dancey, moody. adore did not take me aback one bit when i heard it. something like machina would have surprised me more in 1998.

ok, even if I agree with you on some of those songs, the point is every album up to that point had some "rock" songs mixed in with the slower stuff. It's not that the stuff on Adore was completely new territory for the band, it's that the big guitar driven stuff was completely gone for the first time.

But you seriously think a song like "tonight, tonight" prepared people for an album like adore? Does anybody listen to tonight, tonight and think "yeah, this could easily fit on Adore"?

[vixnix]

No, because Tonight, tonight was quite beautifully arranged. That's the difference...the song itself could have easily fitted on Adore but the grandiose strings and polish of the production make it very different. If you listen to the tonite reprise it feels very much like something that could have fitted in. Not fierce or passionate but wistful and melancholic like Adore.

[ButterflyBullets]

I loved it to be honest, it was just a nice change of pace and something really different from them. Ava Adore, Perfect, Daphne Descends and For Martha really jumped out at me, I just think those songs are beautiful, especially Daphne Descends and For Martha.

[purelunasea80]

stellar., on 18 June 2011 - 10:33 PM, said:

ok, even if I agree with you on some of those songs, the point is every album up to that point had some "rock" songs mixed in with the slower stuff. It's not that the stuff on Adore was completely new territory for the band, it's that the big guitar driven stuff was completely gone for the first time.

But you seriously think a song like "tonight, tonight" prepared people for an album like adore? Does anybody listen to tonight, tonight and think "yeah, this could easily fit on Adore"?

does it have to be able to fit on adore to be a predictor of it? the grandeur, the strings, the arrangement...it had a different sensibility than anything they'd done on sd, even though i could certainly see it coming from things like spaceboy and luna...there was just something about tonight tonight where the cure influence was starting to come through more than the zeppelin one. and note that it's one of the only MCIS songs they did regularly on the adore tour, albeit with a leaner arrangement.

[adamdanger!]

vixnix, on 18 June 2011 - 09:36 PM, said:

Of those songs the only one I liked was To Sheila. And even then it felt like a lean offering. Everybody hates Annie Dog but it was the only one I ever played to anyone and it's still my favorite off the album. I did think the others were interesting but I didn't like them enough to really want to listen to them. A lot of the production I found to be kinda off putting. A lot of layers put in by someone who didn't know what they were doung when they put each piece in it's place. I think if they'd had a better producer I probably would have liked a lot of those songs. I probably liked Annie Dog and to Sheila because they were stripped down. If the whole album had that minimalist feel I might have really loved it. Or if it had all the bells and whistles but had been better arranged like SD and MCIS I would have probably enjoyed it, too.

Complete opposite for me. I thought it was too sparse at first, but grew to appreciate all the layers and melodies that aren't apparent at first listen.

[system_failure01]

unfortunately i didn't experience this stuff when it came out at first - i'm 19.

But when I first heard Adore, i could see the good songwriting was still there, but I did have to listen to it 3/4 times before I actually liked the sound they'd made.

Daphne Descends is a really good song.

[Deleted User Account]

purelunasea80, on 19 June 2011 - 06:10 PM, said:

does it have to be able to fit on adore to be a predictor of it? the grandeur, the strings, the arrangement...it had a different sensibility than anything they'd done on sd, even though i could certainly see it coming from things like spaceboy and luna...there was just something about tonight tonight where the cure influence was starting to come through more than the zeppelin one. and note that it's one of the only MCIS songs they did regularly on the adore tour, albeit with a leaner arrangement.

The closest analogue to Tonight is Disarm. In fact, they're really not so different.

[killer_in_me]

Nobody has mentioned appels+oranjes which to me is the coolest song on adore

[paco5005]

My first impression was: "What the fuck is this? It's pure crap!"
But then i listened to it's songs, separately, and one by one I started to like them. First, Tale of Dusty and Pistol Pete. THen, Ava Adore, Shame and To Sheila; and so on. When I finally listened to the full record, I was like: "Wait, was this really the album that I thought was crap?"

[crepe]

For long I thought it was their best album. No problem with its electronic elements as I'm a fan of a few rock/electro albums like Kid A

[eurojesus]

I saw them play just before the album came out and loved how heavy tear was and loved the acoustic version of perfect. So when I heard the album shortly after I was pretty disappointed with all the different arrangements, but I love it now :)/>

[ItsSoPringles]

first reaction was "what the fuck is this, this sucks"

to see how that changed just look at the bottem left hand corner of this comment

[sleeprunner]

listened to it first on headphones at HMV - couldn't wait the journey home. knew and loved some songs from the Shepherd's Bush showcase the previous month, especially To Sheila and Ava Adore. Night Mare and Dusty & Pistol Pete were the two that hit me on first listen as being so different from anything i had heard before, sublime. On first listen(s), Annie Dog and Shame were the only underwhelming tracks.

[Deleted User Account]

I didn't like it on a whole. I thought the production, like the cover, was monochromatic and boring, especially after Mellon Collie.

I liked certain parts; Ava Adore, Perfect (hit me hard, brah), Apples and Oranjes, Pug, Behold! The Nite Mare, Shame, For Martha. But it was an album I skipped through to hit those moments; I didn't like it as a "work". I do now, though. I think it was a bold artistic choice, but I also sympathize with my older (younger?) self in not appreciating it. It's not necessarily an easy album to love if you're coming into the Pumpkins camp on the heels of the Everlasting Gaze's fuzz guitars and Mellon Collie's reckless abandon.

[chrisothoulos]

I really liked Ava Adore and Pug, because they were the 'hard' songs on the album. It took a little time but a few years later I was in love with the album.. It took me a couple years to see the beauty of "To Sheila". It is now one of my favorite Pumpkins albums, when the mood strikes