[Arnold_Schwarzenegger]

http://grungereport.net/2010/05/10/grunger...a-auf-der-maur/

"At that time I did go to Chicago to record a song with Billy for my record that ended up being musically not fitting for this record but I do have a really beautiful outtake of a song that we wrote and recorded together. It was right at that time that he was playing with the idea of bringing it back together, we did have a brief conversation in Chicago about him maybe reaching out to James [Iha] and would I be interested and having a very light conversation about it where I said I’d consider it of course. Then I guess he sort of went to a more of a focused him and Jimmy [Chamberlin] direction, which was his decision. But there was a very brief moment while I was in the studio recording my song with him where we did discuss it, but we never talked about it again."

[doomsdayclock]

That's depressing. wish billy had stuck with his initial gut instinct to reach out to james and melissa.

[andrewface]

damn:( the james part

[Brown_Town]

Fuck man. Sad stuff.

[showers]

im glad this happened.

[dhcutt]

wonder where there at in a parallel universe

[standing.]

wonder where there at in a parallel universe

in a parallel universe of course

[dhcutt]

wonder where there at in a parallel universe

in a parallel universe of course

maybe their awesomeness will make it collapse and they can join us here

[jaggedjunkie21]

I want to hear this outtake. It's probably the best song she's worked on since her first record. OOOM is dreadful.

[RottingApples]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

[antipop]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

.

[CoolAsIceCream]

why should he have reached out to james?

[antipop]

Why shouldn't he?

[Parksey]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

I wouldn't say it "basically confirms" that BC didn't reach out to James. If James rejected his approach then maybe Billy just thought that fresh start was the way to go.

Maybe this is just wishful thinking.

[CoolAsIceCream]

Why shouldn't he?

because billy didn't want a pixies reunion. (aka, play the old songs and cash in, but don't speak to each other off stage. and don't record anything new.)

[robochimp7]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

I don't see how this confirms that at all. He talked to melissa about doing it and then he decided to go in another direction, perhaps because james didnt want to do it.

[jeffdharlan]

I agree with Cool. BC speaks of how dreadful it was pretending to enjoy the last years of SPv1 - where they hid a lot of internal conflict from the fans/media. Why get back into that situation where he and James are not on good terms?

[serotoninsage]

why do 90% of people around here don't realize how complicated human relationships are...especially ones with a 15+ year history? when two people break their relationship, whatever it is, especially after being together as working unit for so long...they usually never get back together. and if they do, it's usually for some cold contractual mutual benefit. look outside the SP world and into the world in general. if you come back and tell me (or anyone) that it's common that people get back together as a healthy working unit/partnership, you're bloody lying.

MY only hope of the BC and JI thing is that one day, they can sit down and have lunch with one another and talk about how each of their lives is doing and all that without wanting anything from the other in terms of their careers. what's REALLY sad, if any of you honestly cared about each of them as people, is that they never ever ever speak and NOT that they don't play music together anymore.

THAT'S painful to both of them, regardless of what is said/not said in the media by either -- and on the "fan side" of things, it's actually being a total jerk for only wanting them to get back together just to play for your enjoyment (not that people wouldn't just complain about something else if BC and JI got back together in the same band)...just leave it alone.

[Mayfair]

im glad this happened.

you would be

[hotoriousDICK]

why do 90% of people around here don't realize how complicated human relationships are...especially ones with a 15+ year history? when two people break their relationship, whatever it is, especially after being together as working unit for so long...they usually never get back together. and if they do, it's usually for some cold contractual mutual benefit. look outside the SP world and into the world in general. if you come back and tell me (or anyone) that it's common that people get back together as a healthy working unit/partnership, you're bloody lying.

MY only hope of the BC and JI thing is that one day, they can sit down and have lunch with one another and talk about how each of their lives is doing and all that without wanting anything from the other in terms of their careers. what's REALLY sad, if any of you honestly cared about each of them as people, is that they never ever ever speak and NOT that they don't play music together anymore.

THAT'S painful to both of them, regardless of what is said/not said in the media by either -- and on the "fan side" of things, it's actually being a total jerk for only wanting them to get back together just to play for your enjoyment (not that people wouldn't just complain about something else if BC and JI got back together in the same band)...just leave it alone.

Ah you always have sense!

I agree with you totally. Not denying how great it would be, in a perfect world, that they got back their musical relationship but if their musical paths since their split showed us anything is that they are both on VERY different musical journeys. They musically can not fit anymore.

I also agree that I'd much rather be able to talk to each other amicably and regain some semblance of a relationship. I really don't want them to play together any more because it will destroy them (further).

Billy had his reason for not REALLY reaching out to James. I think it was really for the best. James would have turned it down I think because, like I said, musically he's not on that page anymore.

I do wish Billy, James, Jimmy and D'arcy a chance to be able to sit together and talk and be some level of friends again. As their fan I do respect them as people and want whats best for them too. I know as a level headed fan that them getting back together musically is the worst thing to do right now.

It's like Pink Floyd. David and Roger are probably on speaking terms but they should never get in the studio together or go on tour as PF because that's going to tear them apart again. It almost did for Live 8.

[doomsdayclock]

I want to hear this outtake. It's probably the best song she's worked on since her first record. OOOM is dreadful.

WHAT!!! OOOM is awesome!

[serotoninsage]

why do 90% of people around here don't realize how complicated human relationships are...especially ones with a 15+ year history? when two people break their relationship, whatever it is, especially after being together as working unit for so long...they usually never get back together. and if they do, it's usually for some cold contractual mutual benefit. look outside the SP world and into the world in general. if you come back and tell me (or anyone) that it's common that people get back together as a healthy working unit/partnership, you're bloody lying.

MY only hope of the BC and JI thing is that one day, they can sit down and have lunch with one another and talk about how each of their lives is doing and all that without wanting anything from the other in terms of their careers. what's REALLY sad, if any of you honestly cared about each of them as people, is that they never ever ever speak and NOT that they don't play music together anymore.

THAT'S painful to both of them, regardless of what is said/not said in the media by either -- and on the "fan side" of things, it's actually being a total jerk for only wanting them to get back together just to play for your enjoyment (not that people wouldn't just complain about something else if BC and JI got back together in the same band)...just leave it alone.

Ah you always have sense!

I agree with you totally. Not denying how great it would be, in a perfect world, that they got back their musical relationship but if their musical paths since their split showed they are both on VERY different musical journeys. They musically can not fit anymore.

I also agree that I'd much rather be able to talk to each other amicably and regain some semblance of a relationship. I really don't want them to play together any more because it will destroy them (further).

Billy had his reason for not REALLY reaching out to James. I think it was really for the best. James would have turned it down I think because, like I said, musically he's not on that page anymore.

I do wish Billy, James, Jimmy and D'arcy a chance to be able to sit together and talk and be some level of friends again. As their fan I do respect them as people and want whats best for them too. I know as a level headed fan that them getting back together musically is the worst thing to do right now.

It's like Pink Floyd. David and Roger are probably on speaking terms but they should never get in the studio together or go on tour as PF because that's going to tear them apart again. It almost did for Live 8.

one of my favourite Canadian bands, The Tea Party, split after 15+ years together. it's been about 6 years since then...and for the first time since that span of time, they sat down together and "talked" -- that news was all the buzz -- but those people are all much more sensible human beings than the combination of minds that go into SP (much healthier minds, really) -- alot like MadM ..maybe it's a Canadian thing (American jab there, hehe)...but yea...i just wish "fans" would let it go because they do their part at poking the dead horse with a stick that forces a media response...and media responses are never the truth..they just cater to what the public wants to hear or what will get the public talking about bullshit that isn't really true or issues that are long gone under the table (JC talked about it once in an interview about how interviewers and fans tend to rehash old shit that was dealt with by the band, personally and quietly...and then it just made things shitty for everyone again)...

but "fans" are just that...they aren't people that care for SP as people...and how can we, honestly? right? and the people who try to care so much for the members of SP as people are just plain disturbed and creepy, in my opinion... so...it's best to just leave it the fuck alone.

anyway.. i do still hope things will level out once BC realizes his age and that one secret to happiness is having close and long-term relationships to rely on as you get older in life. friends and family are nicer to have than God.

[hotoriousDICK]

@doomsday clock. that was going to be my next comment.

OOOM is one solid album! its probably gonna top my best of 2010 list...

[Mayfair]

James would have turned it down I think because, like I said, musically he's not on that page anymore.

James would have turned it down for another reason. a reason that if i post it, will get deleted as it is considered "slander" against our beloved and most cherished BC.

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

what i have been saying all along. and everyone is like "shut the fuck up you james lover!!!! BC wanted him back and james was a dick and said no!!!!"

and i kept telling everyone who the REAL fucking asshole has been all along.

[hotoriousDICK]

@Mayfair. Possibly for disregard for Billy too but we won't ever know what James feels toward billy because if it's one thing I can't ever gave James bad for is that he took the high road.

James took the high road and never said a bad word about Billy publicly. I love Billy but, like Courtney, he needs to learn to keep things private and go see a shrink or talk it out with a friend instead of airing it out in public.

[Mayfair]

I love Billy but, like Courtney, he needs to learn to keep things private and go see a shrink or talk it out with a friend instead of airing it out in public.

fuck yes. James is the king. BC is a...........

[RottingApples]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck.

I don't see how this confirms that at all. He talked to melissa about doing it and then he decided to go in another direction, perhaps because james didnt want to do it.

It doesn't explicitly, but think about it. If he hardly discussed it with Melissa, and they're on good terms, what makes anyone think he even approached James about it? I'm not saying that the outcome would have been any different. James would have declined for one reason or another, but it just really seems that Billy couldn't swallow his pride and reach out to even talk to James. I've always gotten the vibe that BC wanted James to come to him, not the other way around.

[Mayfair]

and there was that shitty small town newspaper interview with James where he said he was asked.

But i think that was to give the illusion that everything was cool and he was approached but said no. maybe he was embarrassed that he wasn't even asked, who knows.

but that small town paper interview is bullshit. i am calling it right now.

[lucciola]

It doesn't explicitly, but think about it. If he hardly discussed it with Melissa, and they're on good terms, what makes anyone think he even approached James about it? I'm not saying that the outcome would have been any different. James would have declined for one reason or another, but it just really seems that Billy couldn't swallow his pride and reach out to even talk to James. I've always gotten the vibe that BC wanted James to come to him, not the other way around.

This. A thousand times. He's this way with everyone and everything. That strange mix of insecurity and arrogance he's famous for.

Mayfair, James didn't specifically say Billy asked him, did he? He just said he was asked? I don't remember. My point being, it seems more Billy's way to dispatch a third party to broach the subject with James, rather than do it himself.

Remember that Billy sent Gooch to initiate talks w/ Jimmy.

[Mayfair]

Remember that Billy sent Gooch to initiate talks w/ Jimmy.

THAT I did not know.


and yeah, i cant remember the interview, but maybe JI wasn't asked directly. which would have sucked balls. I would have been insulted if I were him.

[RottingApples]

Remember that Billy sent Gooch to initiate talks w/ Jimmy.

Really? I though Billy and Jimmy always had a totally open line of communication (till last year). On a side note, does anyone know if Gooch is still even with the band?

[lucciola]

MY only hope of the BC and JI thing is that one day, they can sit down and have lunch with one another and talk about how each of their lives is doing and all that without wanting anything from the other in terms of their careers. what's REALLY sad, if any of you honestly cared about each of them as people, is that they never ever ever speak and NOT that they don't play music together anymore.

Serotonin is right. This is essential and overrides everything else.

I'm sorry for the music we all lost and shame on the four of them for the part they each played in destroying one of the more creative and talented bands in recent history, but more significant is that Billy's relationships with 3 of the most important people in his life are so irrevocably damaged. Also, that so many of those he apparently can't manage to speak to civily have maintained friendly ties among themselves, is sad beyond description and probably says more about the situation than he's willing to admit.

[lucciola]

Remember that Billy sent Gooch to initiate talks w/ Jimmy.

Really? I though Billy and Jimmy always had a totally open line of communication (till last year). On a side note, does anyone know if Gooch is still even with the band?

I'm refering to the time after Jimmy was fired in 96.

Jimmy and Billy didn't speak at all then. Gooch kept the line of communication open with Jimmy. So, I suppose somewhat understandably, when King Billy was ready to invite Jimmy back he sent Gooch off with an offer to speak.

[vjetz]

!!!!!!!!!!

[RottingApples]

I'm refering to the time after Jimmy was fired in 96.

Jimmy and Billy didn't speak at all then. Gooch kept the line of communication open with Jimmy. So, I suppose somewhat understandably, when King Billy was ready to invite Jimmy back he sent Gooch off with an offer to speak.

I feel stupid. I totally forgot about that, and was thinking about 2005.

[lucciola]

Don't feel stupid, RottingApples. It was my fault. I should have been more specific.

[themadcaplaughs]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck. nope.gif

I did not bother to read the rest of this thread because IHA confirmed in 2009 that he WAS invited by Billy to be part of Smashing Pumpkins again.

http://www.pioneerlocal.com/vernonhills/en...2909-s1.article

Direct quote from Iha people:

The Pioneer Press spoke with Chicago native [James] Iha — he is a graduate of Elk Grove Village High School — best known for his work with the ’90s alt-powerhouse Pumpkins. Iha now lives in New York but, he says, “I still come back to Chicago to eat pizza.” While reluctant to talk about his days with the Pumpkins or the band’s recent reunion, which didn’t include him, he confirms he was indeed asked by Corgan to reunite with the band but declined. “I’m not really answering too many questions about the Pumpkins just because I don’t wanna make it a thing about that,” he says. “I just want to keep it positive as far as being proud of what we accomplished while I was in the band.”

[Mayfair]

So this basically confirms he never really reached out to James. What a fuck. nope.gif

I did not bother to read the rest of this thread because IHA confirmed in 2009 that he WAS invited by Billy to be part of Smashing Pumpkins again.

http://www.pioneerlocal.com/vernonhills/en...2909-s1.article

Direct quote from Iha people:

The Pioneer Press spoke with Chicago native [James] Iha — he is a graduate of Elk Grove Village High School — best known for his work with the ’90s alt-powerhouse Pumpkins. Iha now lives in New York but, he says, “I still come back to Chicago to eat pizza.” While reluctant to talk about his days with the Pumpkins or the band’s recent reunion, which didn’t include him, he confirms he was indeed asked by Corgan to reunite with the band but declined. “I’m not really answering too many questions about the Pumpkins just because I don’t wanna make it a thing about that,” he says. “I just want to keep it positive as far as being proud of what we accomplished while I was in the band.”

and there was that shitty small town newspaper interview with James where he said he was asked.

But i think that was to give the illusion that everything was cool and he was approached but said no. maybe he was embarrassed that he wasn't even asked, who knows.

but that small town paper interview is bullshit. i am calling it right now.

[themadcaplaughs]

It doesn't explicitly, but think about it. If he hardly discussed it with Melissa, and they're on good terms, what makes anyone think he even approached James about it? I'm not saying that the outcome would have been any different. James would have declined for one reason or another, but it just really seems that Billy couldn't swallow his pride and reach out to even talk to James. I've always gotten the vibe that BC wanted James to come to him, not the other way around.

This. A thousand times. He's this way with everyone and everything. That strange mix of insecurity and arrogance he's famous for.

Mayfair, James didn't specifically say Billy asked him, did he? He just said he was asked? I don't remember. My point being, it seems more Billy's way to dispatch a third party to broach the subject with James, rather than do it himself.

Remember that Billy sent Gooch to initiate talks w/ Jimmy.

While technically you're right, there is more to the story than that. Corgan said he had Gooch contact Chamberlin first because he had stayed in touch with Jimmy and Billy did not want to offend him by running back into his life after two and a half years with no communication. Once Gooch gave the go word that Jimmy was interested, Billy met Jimmy for lunch. They talk about it briefly in that Machina promo video that came out in 2000, and I remember long ago reading some interview with Jimmy where he talked about lunch and said that when Billy said "We're practicing next week" (or something to that effect) he knew he was back in.

Mayfair can vouch for me that I'm not a Billy apologist, but I do think he is not ALWAYS entirely to blame, and will give him the benefit of the doubt. I am not calling bullshit on the Iha interview, because frankly James could have simply chosen not to discuss Smashing pumpkins like he did in EVERY OTHER Tinted Windows interview.

[Mayfair]

yeah, we can go back and forth over this shit for years if we want, never knowing what really happened.

wow, sounds like my entire oboard career.

[themadcaplaughs]

yeah, we can go back and forth over this shit for years if we want, never knowing what really happened.

wow, sounds like my entire oboard career.

Haha indeed. You know I'll always have your back around here Mayfair. We need someone to tell Billy like it is.

[DeepPurple]

Billy diddnt contact James
Billy got Gooch to talk to Jimmy
Billy diddnt get Melissa to play bass
Billy raped my cat and framed my grandfather for it
Billy said the sky wasnt blue when it clearly was
Billy told me I had hepatitis, but I went to the blood bank and they took some anyway
Billy had a baby with a walrus and named him Mortimer
Billy eradicated a species already on the verge of extinction and then wrote a song about it just to rub it in.
Blah, Blah, Blah
Cry two tears in a bucket...fuck it.

[AlienCloak]

What do you think about Billy firing Jimmy last year and now continuing to use the Pumpkins name without any former members?


Again, similar to Courtney, I mean there’s a reason why people are fascinated by me having worked with these two very dominant personalities. If there were ever bands with real dominant frontpeople, it’s those two people right, there’s no question. A band like Led Zeppelin or even Nirvana for that matter, there’s some bands that are just more bands and then there’s other bands where the frontpeople are so strong and so massive in personality, obviously I guess they seem to have the final say. So in some ways I’m not surprised that Courtney and Billy would go in this direction. I have always been essentially, even though my identity and my love and my journey in music is entirely wrapped around the legacy of Hole and the Pumpkins, but in many ways remember I was an outsider that came in to replace two very said departures. When Kristen died and when D’arcy left, those were very very sad moments for those bands and I came in in such an extreme replacement position that in some ways I think my participation was very emotional because of what it represented. In other ways it was so intense that quite often I felt as if I was an outsider. So in many ways, I feel like I can’t voice an opinion in terms of as a member of the band. I mean I’ve obviously been a sort of honorary visiting member in those bands, so I’m very careful about making vague statements about the bandleader’s decisions. For example with Hole I am the longest standing band member of Hole other than Eric and Courtney, so in that case I do feel a little more involved in its history, but on a legal level Courtney and Eric are the co-founders. In the case of the Pumpkins I was basically a Pumpkins fan that got to live my dream for a moment so I have no right to make any judgment. I will point out though that I think from what I remember legally Billy was the owner of the name. I hope I’m not saying the wrong thing but I think it’s true, so if you’re just looking on a legal standpoint, not that music should be anything about law, believe me I’m not saying that should be the reason, but I believe that Billy is the founder, and ultimately that’s probably why he made his own decisions. I don’t know the details about Jimmy leaving last year, I mean I was curious because Jimmy and Billy are such an intertwined musical force and it did surprise me. I don’t know the details so I don’t know what happened and whether it was a bad thing good thing, I have no idea. But I’m not surprised that Billy would continue with the vision.

[lucciola]

While technically you're right, there is more to the story than that. Corgan said he had Gooch contact Chamberlin first because he had stayed in touch with Jimmy and Billy did not want to offend him by running back into his life after two and a half years with no communication. Once Gooch gave the go word that Jimmy was interested, Billy met Jimmy for lunch. They talk about it briefly in that Machina promo video that came out in 2000, and I remember long ago reading some interview with Jimmy where he talked about lunch and said that when Billy said "We're practicing next week" (or something to that effect) he knew he was back in.

Mayfair can vouch for me that I'm not a Billy apologist, but I do think he is not ALWAYS entirely to blame, and will give him the benefit of the doubt. I am not calling bullshit on the Iha interview, because frankly James could have simply chosen not to discuss Smashing pumpkins like he did in EVERY OTHER Tinted Windows interview.

Yes, that's the story as I know it as well. I mentioned Gooch only because if Billy brought Jimmy back into the fold in that manner, it's reasonable to speculate he did the same with James. That was, to my mind, the relevant aspect to the story.

To be fair, I can see why James might have taken offense. I can also understand Billy's desire, if that was indeed the case, to proceed cautiously by sending a third party to feel James out.

I don't think Billy is ALWAYS to blame either. As I said, they each played a part in the demise of the band. However, there's ample evidence to prove Billy's habit of holding a grudge while publicly and viciously attacking his former friends, employees, wife, girlfriend, bandmates etc. If you were James, would you care to pick up the phone after everything that's been said?

Thank you for finding the interview btw. I tried but didn't have any luck.